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12.6.15

Liberals have often not spent time learning Torah. Many have good intentions, but have not absorbed a Torah framework.
The Torah  has laws that are related to how to run a society. And it has laws that deal with personal morality. The parts of the Torah which deal with how to run a society are overwhelmingly conservative and correspond exactly with the USA Republican conservatives. Family values, personal responsibility, limited government. Civil damages are when actual damage has been caused. Not imaginary slights to one's feelings. See Bava Kama in detail.









  • Limited government?
    Tell foreigners you come in peace. If they respond peacefully and welcome you, enslave them. If they don't, kill all the males, enslave the women and children, take everything valuable for yourself, and feast on it as God's gift to you.
    Deut 20:11
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      Limited government as meaning government subject to Torah. I mean inside of Israel the government of kings did not have authority beyond what the Torah gives them explicitly. As for war on nations that are idolaters, you are right that the Torah is harsh. On nations that are not idolaters however, one is not allowed to make war. But the harshness of the Torah towards idolators is not limited to foreign nations. It is a law that the Torah imposes on Jews also. No one is exempt. So if you take offense the fact that the Torah does not like idolaters, well, stand in line and take a number.



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        Personal responsibility?
        Engage in money-lending and usury so Jews can control the world.
        Deut 28:13



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            Usury was the only profession open to Jews in the Middle Ages. We were not allowed to own land. And as far as I know this money lending activity fulfilled an important function during the Middle Ages. When Kings and princess needed money where else could they go to? The peasants? Other kings? The church forbid one Christian from loaning money at interest to another Christian. Jews fulfilled an important role in the building of European Civilization. 


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          Family values?
          If a new husband accuses his wife of not being a virgin, and her parents can not provide hard evidence otherwise, the new bride must be taken to the doorway of her dad's house and men from the neighborhood throw rocks at her until she is dead.
          Deut 22:20
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            See Ketubot in detail. especially page 2. The basic thing to know is that the death penalty comes only with a two witnesses and a married woman. There is a period between ארוסין and נישואין which is not done anymore.But what makes her married is the ארוסין. and this is what the Torah is talking about in that case. So if she is in fact married and there were two witnesses then there is the death penalty. Not otherwise. Plus there has to be a warning: If you do such and such then this will be the penalty right before the actual act.
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              "But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
              Deut 22:20 KJV


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                  See Ketubot. It is fundamental in Torah that there is no death penalty except under the circumstances I stated above. How to deal with these verses is by taking note that the conditions for the death penalty are stated elsewhere in deuteronomy. So when we have a seeming contradiction we have to solve it. We can't just go by one verse alone. And the rules about two witnesses is hard and fast. plus the need for the Miranda warnings.



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            After that Willie had a few more comments that I thought it would be best not to reply to because they seemed kind of negative.

            But in fact the when and how of wars against idolatry is not a subject I know much about. Mainly the idea of the Torah is that idolatry is a bad thing. When gentiles do not do idolatry, then things are different. Then they are just people.